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Author Topic: EGW audio & PDF Book- Return of the Latter Rain  (Read 5385 times)

Ed Sutton

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EGW audio & PDF Book- Return of the Latter Rain
« on: May 09, 2014, 08:34:31 AM »
pdf http://www.richardlemay.com/AUD/OTH/RLR/TheReturnOfTheLatterRain.pdf   

audiohttp://ellenwhiteaudio.org/the-return-of-the-latter-rain/


# 36  Ch 4 "most precious Message" chapter end notes ( Bibliography)

Quote
While the earlier authors mentioned above seemed to take their  stance primarily from the motivation of defending the church from the allegation that the message was rejected, the latter authors seem to take their stance primarily because of their push for a Calvinistic Reformation or Evangelical gospel. Others, however, have recognized the 1888 message as something more: “The profound uniting [of law and grace] … was [Ellen White’s] remarkable contribution to the 1888 crisis over salvation by faith. Further, her messages clearly demonstrate that this ‘precious message’ was not a mere recovery of a sixteenth-century emphasis, nor a borrowing of a nineteenth-century Methodist accent. … In the 1888 emphasis, linkage was further made between the results of a personal application of salvation by faith and the closing work of Christ in the Most Holy Place. … The 1888 ‘revelation of the righteousness of Christ’ was only the ‘beginning of the light of the angel whose glory shall fill the whole earth’ (Rev. 18:4)” (Herbert E. Douglass, Messenger of the Lord, [1998], pp. 197, 198).

Again, Douglass counters claims by modern church historians when he states: “The other rewrite has been the concurrent reluctance to review the theological detour that occurred [since the 1950s], when denominational publications and academic classrooms opined that the key contribution of the 1888 General Conference was to recognize that Adventists had finally recovered the so-called emphasis of the Protestant Reformers regarding ‘righteousness by faith.’ Nothing could be farther from the truth! This line of reasoning, wherever taught or preached, poisons any genuine study of that remarkable conference. Further, it has locked the door on what Ellen White called ‘a most precious message’—a message that would prepare a people for translation. Some day that door will be unlocked” (A Fork in the Road, [Coldwater, MI: Remnant Publications, Inc., 2008], p. 85).

God was at work - even during EGW's public prayer during the sessions.

Chapter 4  “Most Precious Message”

Quote
chapter end notes# 40. Ellen G. White Manuscript 24, Dec. 1888; in 1888 Materials, p. 218, emphasis supplied. G. B. Starr recalls one such session of prayer at Minneapolis: “Sister White called a large company of ministers together for a season of special prayer. Uniting with others, Sister White, herself, prayed earnestly for the blessing of God upon the conference. In the midst of her prayer, she suddenly stopped for a short period of possibly one-minute; then, completing the broken sentence, finished her prayer.Not one of us who were present and heard her prayer, and noted the break in it, was aware that anything special had happened. But later, Elder W. C. White informed me that it took her six weeks to write out what she had seen in those sixty seconds. The Spirit of God had flashed, in rapid precession, the life and work of many of the ministers kneeling about her. She saw them in their homes, the spirit they manifested, as Christians. She saw them in the sacred desk and heard their manner of presenting the precious truths of the message for this time” (G. B. Starr, “Fifty Years With One of God’s Seers,” unpublished manuscript, pp. 50-152; in Document File 496, Ellen G. White Estate, Silver Spring, MD.

At the end of the Meetings   EJW & ATJ  gave a reply from Scripture alone with no comments from themselves, both standing before the assembly and reading the passages from their Bibles, once finished reading, they gave no comments - letting Scripture speak for it's self.

The 1888 reply of Jones and Waggonner

EJW  Jeremiah 23:5-7

ATJ  Ephesians 2:4-8

EJW  Galatians 2:16-21

ATJ  Romans 11 :1-33

EJW  Romans 1:14-17

ATJ  Romans 2:12-29

EJW  Galatians ch 3 entire

ATJ  Romans ch 3 entire

EJW  Galatians 5:1-6

ATJ  Romans 9:7-33

EJW  Galatians ch 2 entire

ATJ  Romans 4:1-11

EJW  Romans ch 5 entire

ATJ  Romans 4:13-25

EJW  Romans ch 6 entire

ATJ  Romans 1:15-17

EJW  Romans 8:14-39

ATJ  1st John 5:1-4
« Last Edit: January 04, 2016, 03:53:11 AM by Ed Sutton »
Logged
Grateful for Psalms 32 and Titus 2:10 While it is true that God gives the message from Scripture and SOP. The taste I give to others about the message sells it or kills it, I learn to walk it well & cook it well & eat it myself, before I preach it.  Then the SDA message appeals by His righteousness.

newbie

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Re: EGW audio & PDF Book- Return of the Latter Rain
« Reply #1 on: May 09, 2014, 10:49:10 AM »
Quote from: Ed Sutton on May 09, 2014, 08:34:31 AM
http://ellenwhiteaudio.org/audio/en/pioneers/Modern%20Works/Return%20of%20the%20Latter%20Rain/Return%20of%20the%20Latter%20Rain%20%283rd%20Edition%29.pdf


# 36  Ch 5 Bibliography

Quote
While the earlier authors mentioned above seemed to take their  stance primarily from the motivation of defending the church from the allegation that the message was rejected, the latter authors seem to take their stance primarily because of their push for a Calvinistic Reformation or Evangelical gospel. Others, however, have recognized the 1888 message as something more: “The profound uniting [of law and grace] … was [Ellen White’s] remarkable contribution to the 1888 crisis over salvation by faith. Further, her messages clearly demonstrate that this ‘precious message’ was not a mere recovery of a sixteenth-century emphasis, nor a borrowing of a nineteenth-century Methodist accent. … In the 1888 emphasis, linkage was further made between the results of a personal application of salvation by faith and the closing work of Christ in the Most Holy Place. … The 1888 ‘revelation of the righteousness of Christ’ was only the ‘beginning of the light of the angel whose glory shall fill the whole earth’ (Rev. 18:4)” (Herbert E. Douglass, Messenger of the Lord, [1998], pp. 197, 198).

Again, Douglass counters claims by modern church historians when he states: “The other rewrite has been the concurrent reluctance to review the theological detour that occurred [since the 1950s], when denominational publications and academic classrooms opined that the key contribution of the 1888 General Conference was to recognize that Adventists had finally recovered the so-called emphasis of the Protestant Reformers regarding ‘righteousness by faith.’ Nothing could be farther from the truth! This line of reasoning, wherever taught or preached, poisons any genuine study of that remarkable conference. Further, it has locked the door on what Ellen White called ‘a most precious message’—a message that would prepare a people for translation. Some day that door will be unlocked” (A Fork in the Road, [Coldwater, MI: Remnant Publications, Inc., 2008], p. 85).

God was at work - even during EGW's public prayer during the sessions.

Chapter 4  “Most Precious Message”

Quote
chapter end notes# 40. Ellen G. White Manuscript 24, Dec. 1888; in 1888 Materials, p. 218, emphasis supplied. G. B. Starr recalls one such session of prayer at Minneapolis: “Sister White called a large company of ministers together for a season of special prayer. Uniting with others, Sister White, herself, prayed earnestly for the blessing of God upon the conference. In the midst of her prayer, she suddenly stopped for a short period of possibly one-minute; then, completing the broken sentence, finished her prayer.Not one of us who were present and heard her prayer, and noted the break in it, was aware that anything special had happened. But later, Elder W. C. White informed me that it took her six weeks to write out what she had seen in those sixty seconds. The Spirit of God had flashed, in rapid precession, the life and work of many of the ministers kneeling about her. She saw them in their homes, the spirit they manifested, as Christians. She saw them in the sacred desk and heard their manner of presenting the precious truths of the message for this time” (G. B. Starr, “Fifty Years With One of God’s Seers,” unpublished manuscript, pp. 50-152; in Document File 496, Ellen G. White Estate, Silver Spring, MD.

At the end of the Meetings   EJW & ATJ  gave a reply from Scripture alone with no comments from themselves, both standing before the assembly and reading the passages from their Bibles, once finished reading, they gave no comments - letting Scripture speak for it's self.

The 1888 reply of Jones and Waggonner

EJW  Jeremiah 23:5-7

ATJ  Ephesians 2:4-8

EJW  Galatians 2:16-21

ATJ  Romans 11 :1-33

EJW  Romans 1:14-17

ATJ  Romans 2:12-29

EJW  Galatians ch 3 entire

ATJ  Romans ch 3 entire

EJW  Galatians 5:1-6

ATJ  Romans 9:7-33

EJW  Galatians ch 2 entire

ATJ  Romans 4:1-11

EJW  Romans ch 5 entire

ATJ  Romans 4:13-25

EJW  Romans ch 6 entire

ATJ  Romans 1:15-17

EJW  Romans 8:14-39

ATJ  1st John 5:1-4

Ed, who is Ron Duffield? and who is 4th angel publishing?  I have not read this yet...  just wondering.
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Ed Sutton

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Re: EGW audio & PDF Book- Return of the Latter Rain
« Reply #2 on: May 09, 2014, 10:55:59 AM »
Herbert E. Douglass recommends  Ron Duffield's book in the YouTube presentation RE QOD given at SacCentral Church, or the YouTube "what is the 1888 Message", I don't remember exactly which presentation.   

Sac Central Church
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rBY1-MRgMjA

1888
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PbENjXHFu1Q

So I hunted it up and started reading & posted the Audio & PDF link on this tread. ( See topic starting initial post for the link )

Pastor Robert Wieland - studying the 1888 messages

Robert Wieland, Christ In the Most Holy Place, Part 1
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KAlG-QNG2jE 

Robert Wieland, Christ In the Most Holy Place, Part 2
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lKP5S0BDk14
**********************************************************

Pastor John Peters - Southwestern Adventist University - topic - The Most Holy Place
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ULoM_UmjntM

I had wondered how Uriah Smith ever got the idea that "the daily" was paganism - here he is expounding on "gadal" and now I see how U. Smith got his view, his view which slanted his whole view of the Sanctuary, because it changed his focus and here this pastor is applying it differently than I have ever heard it.  If the U. Smith view is shown by SOP to have went counter to the earlier views that EGW said was correct and held - then this pastor's link will be deleted and SOP references defining the situation will be posted.
« Last Edit: May 10, 2014, 04:01:13 AM by Ed Sutton »
Logged
Grateful for Psalms 32 and Titus 2:10 While it is true that God gives the message from Scripture and SOP. The taste I give to others about the message sells it or kills it, I learn to walk it well & cook it well & eat it myself, before I preach it.  Then the SDA message appeals by His righteousness.

Ed Sutton

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  • Posts: 2917
Re: EGW audio & PDF Book- Return of the Latter Rain
« Reply #3 on: May 09, 2014, 11:21:43 AM »
This is a very well put together book of SDA history.

Sometimes the chapter end notes are as, or more, informative than the chapters.  For example :

Ch 5  "stand by your post"  #49    RE Elder Morrison

Quote
49. Morrison had “studied infidel books … to meet opponents in arguments” (1888 Materials, p. 601). Ellen White warned that he would bring in “dissensions and bickerings,” and unless he overcame, he would “make shipwreck of faith as did Elder Canright” (p. 168). A few days earlier, Ellen White stated that she had seen “an angel of God inquiring of these men who have educated themselves as debaters” (p. 141). G. B. Starr tells of this event years later. He was with J. H. Morrison and two other ministers in the “tent at Oskaloosa, Iowa.” A stranger “entered the tent door,” one of “the finest looking men” he had ever seen. He was “over six feet tall” and “had such a kindly expression on his face.” He went directly to Morrison and asked about the tent meetings and what Seventh-day Adventists believed. “At first [Morrison] replied to the questions in a kindly spirit but soon assumed a debating, controversial attitude … After about an hour’s such conversation, the stranger arose in all his dignity, and addressing [Morrison] said, ‘You are no minister of Jesus Christ; you are a controversialist, sir.’ Instead of [Morrison] realizing that he had been properly rebuked, he instead chuckled and laughed, and said, ‘Oh, you can’t meet the argument.’” The stranger made no reference to Morrison’s comment but repeated himself. This happened twice.[u] When G. B. Starr told Ellen White of this event she replied[/u]: “‘Why, Brother Starr, that was an angel of God … Why I gave that message to that brother at the Minneapolis Conference, and told him that the Lord had sent an angel to rebuke him for his controversial manner of labor’” (G. B. Starr, “Fifty Years With One of God’s Seers,” unpublished manuscript, pp. 150-152; in Document File 496, Ellen G. White Estate, Silver Spring, MD). This may explain why Ellen White would get up and leave when Morrison spoke. It also explains what Jones and Waggoner were up against.

******************************

For the most part lies have been repeated for decades regarding A T Jones & E J Waggoner and their messages and ministerial acceptance of it. This book brings out the actual detailed history and tells it like it really was, giving exceedingly many bibliography references, and strong scholarship.

Quote
All regret that they have been so long ignorant of what constituted true religion. They are sorry that they have not known that it was true religion to depend entirely upon Christ's righteousness, and not upon works of merit. {7MR 248.2}  {1888 289.1}


Very few non EGW, SDA books available to me, have risen to such a level of accurate scholarship and in such a good cause, telling the story of men dedicated to the cause despite organized opposition that finally broke them, and beginning of the journey to locate what was actually presented.
« Last Edit: May 09, 2014, 04:49:45 PM by Ed Sutton »
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Grateful for Psalms 32 and Titus 2:10 While it is true that God gives the message from Scripture and SOP. The taste I give to others about the message sells it or kills it, I learn to walk it well & cook it well & eat it myself, before I preach it.  Then the SDA message appeals by His righteousness.

newbie

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Re: EGW audio & PDF Book- Return of the Latter Rain
« Reply #4 on: May 12, 2014, 10:17:17 AM »
thanks Ed for that clarification...
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Ed Sutton

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Re: EGW audio & PDF Book- Return of the Latter Rain
« Reply #5 on: July 26, 2014, 05:41:57 AM »
Listening to - EJW Lessons on Faith - now      :-D

http://ellenwhiteaudio.org/pioneers/e-j-waggoner/lessons-on-faith/ 

and simultaneously reading the pdf using both at the same time helps absorption.

http://www.tffgny.org/resources/lessons_on_faith.pdf

*******************************************

Found YouTube Videos - Waggoner   " Lessons on Faith"

http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=waggoner+%22Lessons+on+Faith%22
« Last Edit: July 31, 2014, 04:54:58 PM by Ed Sutton »
Logged
Grateful for Psalms 32 and Titus 2:10 While it is true that God gives the message from Scripture and SOP. The taste I give to others about the message sells it or kills it, I learn to walk it well & cook it well & eat it myself, before I preach it.  Then the SDA message appeals by His righteousness.

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